BioEnergy Lists: Gasifiers & Gasification

For more information about Gasifiers and Gasification, please see our web site: http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org

To join the discussion list and see the current archives, please use this page: http://listserv.repp.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_listserv.repp.org

October 2001 Gasification Archive

For more messages see our 1996-2004 Gasification Discussion List Archives.

From hseaver at cybershamanix.com Thu Oct 4 13:16:01 2001
From: hseaver at cybershamanix.com (Harmon Seaver)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: woodgas emissions?
Message-ID: <3BBC981E.8F612BAA@cybershamanix.com>

Does anyone have figures on what the actual emissions are from
burning woodgas under different conditions, such as burning it in a open
burner, and burning it in an IC engine?

--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From hseaver at cybershamanix.com Fri Oct 5 10:53:39 2001
From: hseaver at cybershamanix.com (Harmon Seaver)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] Re wood gas emissions
In-Reply-To: <165.1ec1e61.28ef0e18@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3BBDC83F.D2B37C89@cybershamanix.com>

Thanx, but burning wood and making woodgas are quite a bit different. I
guess I need to rephrase my question. I'm building a wood gasifier. Woodgas
should be, if I understand it correctly, primarily CO and H2, along with N.
And as I recall from reading years ago, the exhaust of an engine running on
woodgas should be pretty pure CO2 & N, plus perhaps some H20. What about if you
burn that woodgas in a gas cooking range? Is it the same, or don't you get as
clean a burn?
I've been searching the net for this, haven't found anything so far, also
can't seem to find an actual BTU rating for woodgas, comparisions with natural
gas, etc.

glenne1949@aol.com wrote:

> No I don't have the specific info. I do know that Dept of Energy, or
> perhaps it was ERDA before DOE, did a study though one of their labs on the
> emissions from simply burning wood. There were, as I recollect, some 18
> different toxic emissions, a number of them carcinogenic, in the wood smoke.
> This study was perhaps 8 or 10 years ago.
>

--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From Gavin at roseplac.worldonline.co.uk Fri Oct 5 11:11:21 2001
From: Gavin at roseplac.worldonline.co.uk (Gavin Gulliver-Goodall)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] Re wood gas emissions
In-Reply-To: <3BBDC83F.D2B37C89@cybershamanix.com>
Message-ID: <MABBJLGAAFJBOBCKKPMGEEJPCDAA.Gavin@roseplac.worldonline.co.uk>

Yes burning on stoves will be just as clean depending on the nozzle design
to ensure optimum gas-air mixing.
CV of woodgas varies according to fuel, gasifier etc but 4 Mj/kg seems a
realistic number from memory Stoichiometric ration with air is about 1:1
where as propane is 22:1
Depending on temperature and exact conditions of combustion you may have NOx
or CO in the exhaust too.

-----Original Message-----
From: Harmon Seaver [mailto:hseaver@cybershamanix.com]
Sent: Friday, October 05, 2001 15:49
To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
Cc: gasification@crest.org
Subject: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] Re wood gas emissions

Thanx, but burning wood and making woodgas are quite a bit different.
I
guess I need to rephrase my question. I'm building a wood gasifier. Woodgas
should be, if I understand it correctly, primarily CO and H2, along with N.
And as I recall from reading years ago, the exhaust of an engine running on
woodgas should be pretty pure CO2 & N, plus perhaps some H20. What about if
you
burn that woodgas in a gas cooking range? Is it the same, or don't you get
as
clean a burn?
I've been searching the net for this, haven't found anything so far,
also
can't seem to find an actual BTU rating for woodgas, comparisions with
natural
gas, etc.

glenne1949@aol.com wrote:

> No I don't have the specific info. I do know that Dept of Energy,
or
> perhaps it was ERDA before DOE, did a study though one of their labs on
the
> emissions from simply burning wood. There were, as I recollect, some 18
> different toxic emissions, a number of them carcinogenic, in the wood
smoke.
> This study was perhaps 8 or 10 years ago.
>

--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From hseaver at cybershamanix.com Sat Oct 6 01:37:05 2001
From: hseaver at cybershamanix.com (Harmon Seaver)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] Re wood gas emissions
In-Reply-To: <MABBJLGAAFJBOBCKKPMGEEJPCDAA.Gavin@roseplac.worldonline.co.uk>
Message-ID: <3BBE9751.2F52C8C@cybershamanix.com>

Gavin Gulliver-Goodall wrote:

> Yes burning on stoves will be just as clean depending on the nozzle design
> to ensure optimum gas-air mixing.
> CV of woodgas varies according to fuel, gasifier etc but 4 Mj/kg seems a
> realistic number from memory Stoichiometric ration with air is about 1:1
> where as propane is 22:1
> Depending on temperature and exact conditions of combustion you may have NOx
> or CO in the exhaust too.

I'd think that more likely to occur with an open burner than in an
engine, especially if you had optimized the engine (advanced the spark at
least) for woodgas. I wonder how easy it would be to run all the regular house
stuff (natural gas boiler, hotwater heater, cookstove) on wood gas? Seems like
I used to have a book that had all that info, but can't remember if I gave it
to someone or what, but anyway, at most it should just require opening up the
gas jets a bit, maybe not even that, maybe just adjusting the air intakes on
the burners.

--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From hseaver at cybershamanix.com Sat Oct 6 16:02:25 2001
From: hseaver at cybershamanix.com (Harmon Seaver)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: gasifiers for logs
In-Reply-To: <165.1ec1e61.28ef0e18@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3BBF621E.41D21B6D@cybershamanix.com>

I've been looking at some of the gasification archive stuff on
gasifiers for green wood and for logs, rather than chips, and started
thinking of building a gasifier out of a 55 gal drum, horizontally,
essentially like a common barrel stove, except that the door and draft
on the end would be at the top, and the flue opening would be on the
bottom, perhaps in the middle of the barrel.
Maybe a bed of firebrick loosely laid over some sort of rack or
grate, so that the gas flow wouldn't be impeded, then a collector
chamber underneath out of a 5 gallon can maybe with some sort of ash
cleanout at the bottom (or maybe the whole thing just taken off
periodically) with the gas pipe outlet higher up on the pail -- then
just standard filter/cooler stuff after that.
Has anyone tried such a design? I'm also wondering about wrapping
copper tubing for heating water around the firebox and gas outlet
--would that have any bad effect on the gasifier, cool it down too much?

--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From hseaver at cybershamanix.com Sat Oct 6 16:04:47 2001
From: hseaver at cybershamanix.com (Harmon Seaver)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] gasifiers for logs
In-Reply-To: <165.1ec1e61.28ef0e18@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3BBF62AE.4AF6026F@cybershamanix.com>

Whoops, forgot to include a couple of URLS showing commercial
boilers which use this design (although they just burn the gas in a
secondary chamber).
http://www.kuenzel.de/English/products/indexEP.htm

http://www.woodboilers.com/wood.html
--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From Gavin at roseplac.worldonline.co.uk Mon Oct 8 05:26:00 2001
From: Gavin at roseplac.worldonline.co.uk (Gavin Gulliver-Goodall)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] Re wood gas emissions
In-Reply-To: <3BBE9751.2F52C8C@cybershamanix.com>
Message-ID: <MABBJLGAAFJBOBCKKPMGCEKBCDAA.Gavin@roseplac.worldonline.co.uk>

Yes you could use all your "normal" gas appliances on wood gas with
modification to the air mixture.
Th UK had Coal gas for a long time and when we changed over to "natural gas
(methane) they had to change all the burners.
The issues with woodgas are to do with making a clean gas and storage youo
should review the archives of this list.
Coal gas was made industrially for many years and the process is very
similar however the Coal gasification process would not now be economic due
to the high labour input and horrible emissions. Biomass could be gasified
in that manner but would not solve anybodies problems. The key on this list
is to do it small scale and/or automatically and basically we are gasifying
at point of use here.
Cheers
gavin

-----Original Message-----
From: Harmon Seaver [mailto:hseaver@cybershamanix.com]
Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2001 6:32
To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
Cc: gasification@crest.org
Subject: Re: GAS-L: Re: [biofuel] Re wood gas emissions

Gavin Gulliver-Goodall wrote:

> Yes burning on stoves will be just as clean depending on the nozzle design
> to ensure optimum gas-air mixing.
> CV of woodgas varies according to fuel, gasifier etc but 4 Mj/kg seems a
> realistic number from memory Stoichiometric ration with air is about 1:1
> where as propane is 22:1
> Depending on temperature and exact conditions of combustion you may have
NOx
> or CO in the exhaust too.

I'd think that more likely to occur with an open burner than in an
engine, especially if you had optimized the engine (advanced the spark at
least) for woodgas. I wonder how easy it would be to run all the regular
house
stuff (natural gas boiler, hotwater heater, cookstove) on wood gas? Seems
like
I used to have a book that had all that info, but can't remember if I gave
it
to someone or what, but anyway, at most it should just require opening up
the
gas jets a bit, maybe not even that, maybe just adjusting the air intakes on
the burners.

--
Harmon Seaver, MLIS
CyberShamanix
Work 920-203-9633
Home 920-233-5820
hseaver@cybershamanix.com
http://www.cybershamanix.com/resume.html

 

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From tmiles at trmiles.com Mon Oct 8 13:43:14 2001
From: tmiles at trmiles.com (Tom Miles)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: 5th Biomass Conference of the Americas Cancelled
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20011008103703.02468d90@pop3.norton.antivirus>

5th Biomass Conference of the Americas Cancelled
The 5th Biomass Conference of the Americas,
originally scheduled for September 17-21, and under consideration for
rescheduling, has been canceled. The Conference was canceled primarily
because of indications of a significant number of cancellations,
particularly non-U.S. attendees and speakers as well as the logistics of
rescheduling this major event. As a result, Conference Organizers are
making plans to provide
refunds
to those of you who have pre-paid for the Conference and its
activities.
We would like to express our sincere apologies for the inconvenience that
this cancellation may have caused. We also want to thank all of you who
have been involved in the organization of the conference as well as those
who have provided abstracts and papers.
If you have comments or questions please contact the conference
organizers
at
bcotacancel@nrel.gov.

Thomas R
Miles          tmiles@trmiles.com
T R Miles,
TCI                  Tel
503-292-0107
1470 SW Woodward Way    Fax
503-292-2919
Portland, OR 97225 USA

From graeme at powerlink.co.nz Wed Oct 10 23:40:17 2001
From: graeme at powerlink.co.nz (Graeme Williams)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Fluidyne Biomass and Engine Conversion Tables.
Message-ID: <002001c15205$c22b0d40$4d9636d2@graeme>

Hello Biomass and Gasification Colleagues

I promised a couple of months ago to dig out our conversion tables for
biomass and engines we developed at Fluidyne for our own use.

Biomass is a fickle fuel and there are always variations to consider in
making calculations. If you just use these basic figures you won't go
wrong, unless that is you crib them to replace laboratory tests, so consider
them real world values!

The engine tables are not found in existing literature and have been tested
over thousands of hours using various engines. Use them sensibly and you
can do all sorts of cross calculations , that is with normally aspirated
engines. No references apply to turbo charged engines.

The tables will be available in a day or so, and we will also add them to
the Fluidyne Archive www.fluidynenz.250x.com

If you choose to include these tables in published literature, then extend
the courtesy of acknowledging their source.

Regards
Doug Williams
Fluidyne Gasification.

-
Gasification List Archives:
http://www.crest.org/discussion/gasification/current/

Gasification List Moderator:
Tom Reed, Biomass Energy Foundation, Reedtb2@cs.com
www.webpan.com/BEF
List-Post: <mailto:gasification@crest.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gasification-help@crest.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gasification-unsubscribe@crest.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gasification-subscribe@crest.org>

Sponsor the Gasification List: http://www.crest.org/discuss3.html
-
Other Gasification Events and Information:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bioam/
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/gasref.shtml
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/biomass-info/

 

From kssustain at provide.net Fri Oct 12 09:30:57 2001
From: kssustain at provide.net (Kermit Schlansker)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:09:42 2004
Subject: GAS-L: Steam Calculations
Message-ID: <001001c15320$d86f0d60$a54256d8@default>

A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: multipart/alternative
Size: 0 bytes
Desc: not available
Url : http://listserv.repp.org/pipermail/gasification/attachments/20011012/78175972/attachment.bin